Film director Jonathan Gazer's acceptance speech went viral. But Jewish community leaders know there will be no professional damage for misrepresenting his words
The problem I have with equating the WWII holocaust with the Israel/Palestine war is that the German state murdered millions who had done nothing to harm them. The Jews, Catholics, Armenians and others who were mass slaughtered in the millions hadn't terror-bombed anyone or tried to wipe out a race of people. They weren't doing anything more than any other European citizen at the time: just living their lives.
In Israel the Palestinian people, first under the Nazi-backed Grand Mufti and surrounding Arab states tried to murder the Jews in the UN mandate. For over a quarter of a century Egypt, Jordan, Syria, etc. tried to destroy the state of Israel and after they failed many Palestinians continued to support the PLO and constant terror attacks against the Jews of Israel and demanded a genocide against the Jews. Hamas is just the latest to take on the goal of killing every Jew in Israel.
It's not the same, and the way most on the left focus solely on the cynical players that manipulate and connive to rid the land of the Palestinians leaves me a bit cold when they ignore the hate and violence coming from the other side.
It's not the same. It's not a simple attempted genocide. After WWII the Jewish population of Europe was roughly 1/4 what it was before the war. The Palestinian population keeps growing despite the alleged "genocide" Israel is carrying out. It's not the same and yet so many like this director and Cook blind themselves to the difference. One needn't support the viciousness of Netanyahu and the fundamentalist nuts in Israel to acknowledge that Hamas and its many Palestinian supporters bear much of the burden for their current plight.
The "how can we resist" really echoed the helpless feeling I think we all have, with millions and millions of voices that cannot seem to stop a genocide
Excellent! Being Jewish has absolutely nothing to do with Zionism. This should be shouted all over the world. Both because of some racist assholes trying to gain traction, and because of some genocide-apologists trying to frame anyone criticising Zionism as anti-Semitic.
I love this bit….alas, our media is full of harlots for Israel
“ She did so because that tweet is her calling card. It declares her not a talented or careful journalist but as something far more useful: one who will do whatever is required to get ahead. Like Shmuley, she was projecting – in her case, with the accusation of “moral rot”. She was advertising that she lacks a moral compass”
These articles always seem to fail at mentioning the mass-murdering, Jew-hating jihadists who have sworn to exterminate Jews and infidels (the West at large). Kinda relevant dontcha think?
You mean I didn't include the stuff being force-fed to you 24-7 by the establishment media. The stuff you need ramming down your throat 24-7 to stop you pausing long enough to wonder whether you're nothing more than a human battery chicken living in a tiny enclosure of thought – your own walled garden.
That is a genuinely darkly funny answer. I’m sympathetic to much of what is happening but I’m also seeing a fair amount of ideological blind spots. I mean this next question in good faith (hard to believe in an online comment section, I know) but I hope it will help me grasp how people are thinking: do you believe that jihadists/hamas and their reported beliefs and actions are a fabrication? Or they are best explained as simply a reactionary force?
You don’t have to answer obviously. And I’m not going to argue with you either way. But I suspect the answer to that question dictates the extreme schism I am seeing.
I can answer your question about the (in your words) "jihadists/hamas" being a fabrication or not. If you like short answers. Here is my answer: We do not know!
If you want to know my reasong why, you may read on!!!
I come from a school of thought that does NOT believe in the existance of the God (Allah) .
Also, I come from a country/environemnt in which following the God is unquestionable and anthiesm (mohareb) is punishable by law. Literally.
Additionally, when it comes to changes in the society, I always separate the state/ government of a country from its inhabitants. The state represents the interests of the ruling class, and the citizens struggle to make a life for themselves and their loved ones.
Given this, the central point of any discussion is humanity. In each multi-sided hostility, one of which being the conflict in Gaza, each side (state or authority which controls its population), tries to maximize their interest/ influence/ gains and every other thing they deem valuable. Specifically, in the Gaza conflicts there are the European governments, the US government, the Arab govenments, the Israel govenment, Iran government, Hamas, Hezbollaj, Houthis, Brics govenments which have some influence on the conflict with varying degrees.
Given the ingredients I mention above, an oversever which has NO real knowledge of the actual facts on the ground, can only analyze based on the track record of the past. Here are what is know:
Hamas: Is an organization which wants to get rid of the Israel and its inhabitants.
Israel: Is a government which is occupying Gaza against the will of the natives.
US: Follows a policy of support for the government of Israel financially, politically, militarily
Brics governments: Are looking for an opening to make something out of this opportunity.
Arab governments: Are looking for ways to defuse this situation since they are all afraid of their own people!
Iran: Has a stated policy aligned with Hamas.
Hezbollah: Is a part of the government of Lebanon and is aligned with Iran.
Houthis: Are aligned with Hamas it seems.
My assessment of what happened on October 7th:
1- Hamas: Tried to force a reaction from the world by targetting civilians in a military action.
2- Israel govenment: Was forced into responding and has gone too far.
That is the most I can say.
Was Hamas actions a "fabrication"? Need more information
Was IDF not anticipating intentional? Need more information
Well said. In a well known quote of Prophet Muhammad, “when you see a wrong, change it with your hands; if you cannot do that then with your words; if you cannot do that then the least is to abhor it in your heart.” South Africa showed how to do the first, Jonathan and others like him are using their voices. More power to them! Let’s all use our voices in our circles of influence. I thank the people of Gaza for waking the moral conscience of the world. I sincerely hope that after this ends it will actualize “never again” with impunity.
Well, they can use bullhorns or megaphones, blasting from all the media outlets that they own. Heck, even holy books were discredited and tossed aside when they didn’t hold up to scrutiny nor backed by facts. There are no sacred cows, it turns out.. in the end, it takes courage to be discerning and honest.
You see the problem they all have, pro Glazer or against him, in the Jews community is the same as the American community has: "should I criminalize continuously and historically America to have killed as many or more as Nazi did with Jews? And continuously killing other country's hope of freedom and democracy since and before WWII?"
I've checked with many Americans and they say they can't because the spirit of US is to be proud of America, whatever it does wrong or right. There is a religious trust in their State no matter what they do. It's not ideology or philosophy, it has all the details of a real RELIGION, unfortunately!
So I think it's the same with Jews community and Israel.
Sorry to say this, but if the World has a problem, that problem is USA first.
If you want to define Americans and Israelis, as nazi, it's fine to me.
But I don't think is completely correct as nationalism for such a long time it never existed in the west. German nazi or italian fascist survived for 10/20 years, nothing in front of America and Israel. So, to survive so long you have to have a religious trust in your Government. It can't be rational, or if it's rational then we talking about nations made of criminals who are completely conscious and share the idea of power thorough crimes, serial crimes.
That's why I often switch the name of USA into United Criminals of America. 😉
I think that the “moral rot” is best epitomized by the pains so many are taking to silence discussion of this tragedy. Many spouses have insisted on not raising the issue in polite company because of the strain it can place on relationships. Complaints that discussing the genocide, or reposting information about it represents forcing others to address something they prefer not to address, because it makes them uncomfortable. For many Zionists, being confronted with the crimes of Israel appears to threaten their most sacred identity, and they do not thank one for this. The charges of “antisemitism” permit Zionists to discredit the information being presented, thereby shielding their core identity from challenge
This of course demonstrates the sense of entitlement, and sense of superiority, wherein their discomfort is more important than the magnitudes-greater discomfort being experienced by their victims.
As you might have guessed, English is not my native tongue. I am going to have to read your reply a few time to get the meaning. But, I have to tell you that in the cultural desert in which I find myself these days, the conversation I had with you is priceless to me. Thank you...
Solid analysis as always from Jonathan Cook. Importance of linking Zionism with neo-liberalism/Western ideology. Established systems will break down, because they need to. Have faith that people around the world in coming together in solidarity can change the status quo. We must be persistent and keep speaking out. There is no going back from what has been done in Palestine. We must be strong at this time as things may become even uglier as establishments become more fearful. They know we are on to them.
Another clear-eyed take by the writer. And how tedious it must be for him to have to examine and clarify - day after day, decade after decade - the statements and actions of self-serving charlatans, with the country-who-shall-not-be-criticized offering the worst example, followed closely by the country-whose-no elections Democracy-we-must-defend. They count on and likely enjoy the time wasted and energy expended sorting through their BS, for none of it is intended to be upheld as true, only to further geopolitical and personal agendas. What wicked people.
The problem I have with equating the WWII holocaust with the Israel/Palestine war is that the German state murdered millions who had done nothing to harm them. The Jews, Catholics, Armenians and others who were mass slaughtered in the millions hadn't terror-bombed anyone or tried to wipe out a race of people. They weren't doing anything more than any other European citizen at the time: just living their lives.
In Israel the Palestinian people, first under the Nazi-backed Grand Mufti and surrounding Arab states tried to murder the Jews in the UN mandate. For over a quarter of a century Egypt, Jordan, Syria, etc. tried to destroy the state of Israel and after they failed many Palestinians continued to support the PLO and constant terror attacks against the Jews of Israel and demanded a genocide against the Jews. Hamas is just the latest to take on the goal of killing every Jew in Israel.
It's not the same, and the way most on the left focus solely on the cynical players that manipulate and connive to rid the land of the Palestinians leaves me a bit cold when they ignore the hate and violence coming from the other side.
It's not the same. It's not a simple attempted genocide. After WWII the Jewish population of Europe was roughly 1/4 what it was before the war. The Palestinian population keeps growing despite the alleged "genocide" Israel is carrying out. It's not the same and yet so many like this director and Cook blind themselves to the difference. One needn't support the viciousness of Netanyahu and the fundamentalist nuts in Israel to acknowledge that Hamas and its many Palestinian supporters bear much of the burden for their current plight.
The "how can we resist" really echoed the helpless feeling I think we all have, with millions and millions of voices that cannot seem to stop a genocide
GREAT article!! Succinct; says it all really.
Excellent! Being Jewish has absolutely nothing to do with Zionism. This should be shouted all over the world. Both because of some racist assholes trying to gain traction, and because of some genocide-apologists trying to frame anyone criticising Zionism as anti-Semitic.
I love this bit….alas, our media is full of harlots for Israel
“ She did so because that tweet is her calling card. It declares her not a talented or careful journalist but as something far more useful: one who will do whatever is required to get ahead. Like Shmuley, she was projecting – in her case, with the accusation of “moral rot”. She was advertising that she lacks a moral compass”
Without morals one cannot have empathy.
Thanks for voicing Humanity.
Glazer, yourself are not alone.
In fact most of the world's population are onboard, just not many from the West.
No matter, Humanity by its very definition will prevail.
These articles always seem to fail at mentioning the mass-murdering, Jew-hating jihadists who have sworn to exterminate Jews and infidels (the West at large). Kinda relevant dontcha think?
Benjamin. You obviously have not read enough about how this happened. I suggest you read more.
You mean I didn't include the stuff being force-fed to you 24-7 by the establishment media. The stuff you need ramming down your throat 24-7 to stop you pausing long enough to wonder whether you're nothing more than a human battery chicken living in a tiny enclosure of thought – your own walled garden.
Yeah, you're right – I didn't do that.
That is a genuinely darkly funny answer. I’m sympathetic to much of what is happening but I’m also seeing a fair amount of ideological blind spots. I mean this next question in good faith (hard to believe in an online comment section, I know) but I hope it will help me grasp how people are thinking: do you believe that jihadists/hamas and their reported beliefs and actions are a fabrication? Or they are best explained as simply a reactionary force?
You don’t have to answer obviously. And I’m not going to argue with you either way. But I suspect the answer to that question dictates the extreme schism I am seeing.
I can answer your question about the (in your words) "jihadists/hamas" being a fabrication or not. If you like short answers. Here is my answer: We do not know!
If you want to know my reasong why, you may read on!!!
I come from a school of thought that does NOT believe in the existance of the God (Allah) .
Also, I come from a country/environemnt in which following the God is unquestionable and anthiesm (mohareb) is punishable by law. Literally.
Additionally, when it comes to changes in the society, I always separate the state/ government of a country from its inhabitants. The state represents the interests of the ruling class, and the citizens struggle to make a life for themselves and their loved ones.
Given this, the central point of any discussion is humanity. In each multi-sided hostility, one of which being the conflict in Gaza, each side (state or authority which controls its population), tries to maximize their interest/ influence/ gains and every other thing they deem valuable. Specifically, in the Gaza conflicts there are the European governments, the US government, the Arab govenments, the Israel govenment, Iran government, Hamas, Hezbollaj, Houthis, Brics govenments which have some influence on the conflict with varying degrees.
Given the ingredients I mention above, an oversever which has NO real knowledge of the actual facts on the ground, can only analyze based on the track record of the past. Here are what is know:
Hamas: Is an organization which wants to get rid of the Israel and its inhabitants.
Israel: Is a government which is occupying Gaza against the will of the natives.
US: Follows a policy of support for the government of Israel financially, politically, militarily
Brics governments: Are looking for an opening to make something out of this opportunity.
Arab governments: Are looking for ways to defuse this situation since they are all afraid of their own people!
Iran: Has a stated policy aligned with Hamas.
Hezbollah: Is a part of the government of Lebanon and is aligned with Iran.
Houthis: Are aligned with Hamas it seems.
My assessment of what happened on October 7th:
1- Hamas: Tried to force a reaction from the world by targetting civilians in a military action.
2- Israel govenment: Was forced into responding and has gone too far.
That is the most I can say.
Was Hamas actions a "fabrication"? Need more information
Was IDF not anticipating intentional? Need more information
Q.E.D.
Well said. In a well known quote of Prophet Muhammad, “when you see a wrong, change it with your hands; if you cannot do that then with your words; if you cannot do that then the least is to abhor it in your heart.” South Africa showed how to do the first, Jonathan and others like him are using their voices. More power to them! Let’s all use our voices in our circles of influence. I thank the people of Gaza for waking the moral conscience of the world. I sincerely hope that after this ends it will actualize “never again” with impunity.
Beautifully stated Jonathon, thank you.
Well, they can use bullhorns or megaphones, blasting from all the media outlets that they own. Heck, even holy books were discredited and tossed aside when they didn’t hold up to scrutiny nor backed by facts. There are no sacred cows, it turns out.. in the end, it takes courage to be discerning and honest.
You see the problem they all have, pro Glazer or against him, in the Jews community is the same as the American community has: "should I criminalize continuously and historically America to have killed as many or more as Nazi did with Jews? And continuously killing other country's hope of freedom and democracy since and before WWII?"
I've checked with many Americans and they say they can't because the spirit of US is to be proud of America, whatever it does wrong or right. There is a religious trust in their State no matter what they do. It's not ideology or philosophy, it has all the details of a real RELIGION, unfortunately!
So I think it's the same with Jews community and Israel.
Sorry to say this, but if the World has a problem, that problem is USA first.
What you speak of is nationalism.
Tell your American friends that what they possess is not a moral compass but a weather vane.
If you want to define Americans and Israelis, as nazi, it's fine to me.
But I don't think is completely correct as nationalism for such a long time it never existed in the west. German nazi or italian fascist survived for 10/20 years, nothing in front of America and Israel. So, to survive so long you have to have a religious trust in your Government. It can't be rational, or if it's rational then we talking about nations made of criminals who are completely conscious and share the idea of power thorough crimes, serial crimes.
That's why I often switch the name of USA into United Criminals of America. 😉
I think that the “moral rot” is best epitomized by the pains so many are taking to silence discussion of this tragedy. Many spouses have insisted on not raising the issue in polite company because of the strain it can place on relationships. Complaints that discussing the genocide, or reposting information about it represents forcing others to address something they prefer not to address, because it makes them uncomfortable. For many Zionists, being confronted with the crimes of Israel appears to threaten their most sacred identity, and they do not thank one for this. The charges of “antisemitism” permit Zionists to discredit the information being presented, thereby shielding their core identity from challenge
This of course demonstrates the sense of entitlement, and sense of superiority, wherein their discomfort is more important than the magnitudes-greater discomfort being experienced by their victims.
Moral rot indeed!
As you might have guessed, English is not my native tongue. I am going to have to read your reply a few time to get the meaning. But, I have to tell you that in the cultural desert in which I find myself these days, the conversation I had with you is priceless to me. Thank you...
Solid analysis as always from Jonathan Cook. Importance of linking Zionism with neo-liberalism/Western ideology. Established systems will break down, because they need to. Have faith that people around the world in coming together in solidarity can change the status quo. We must be persistent and keep speaking out. There is no going back from what has been done in Palestine. We must be strong at this time as things may become even uglier as establishments become more fearful. They know we are on to them.
Another clear-eyed take by the writer. And how tedious it must be for him to have to examine and clarify - day after day, decade after decade - the statements and actions of self-serving charlatans, with the country-who-shall-not-be-criticized offering the worst example, followed closely by the country-whose-no elections Democracy-we-must-defend. They count on and likely enjoy the time wasted and energy expended sorting through their BS, for none of it is intended to be upheld as true, only to further geopolitical and personal agendas. What wicked people.
Thank you👏👏👏